I was unaware of the cartography meaning. I don't know that it's used in science particularly, but I was using it to mean "an item of data", or as dictionary.com describes it, an item of information used in drawing a conclusion.
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datum>Wikipedia is your friend</a>. Basically it's a way of getting a nominal 'centre' of the earth for the purpose of marking lines of latitude and longitude. Because the earth isn't a perfect sphere, this is harder than it sounds...
Wikipedia is your friend (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datum). Basically it's a way of getting a nominal 'centre' of the earth for the purpose of marking lines of latitude and longitude. Because the earth isn't a perfect sphere, this is harder than it sounds...
That is, I did go and check on wikipedia when I read your first post, I'm sorry, I forgot to say so.
'Data' was borrowed into English as a loan-word from Latin. Originally it was probably understood that this was a plural form. However, over the course of a few generations it was reanalysed as a singular, because that made life simpler and we English don't generally form plurals with {-a}. Plus, we don't have the word 'datum' (correction: we do, but it's got a totally different meaning). Etymology ain't worth jack-shit to most people except linguistic pedants - the rest of us form our mental grammars by abductive logic, which is why languages change.
Errr, so I should probably point out the logical leap I made in that comment. If 'data' is a singular (collective?) noun, it should take 'less' and not 'fewer'. Which is how I answered the poll.
I use datum. I mean, if I have a lot of data and one bit is looking odd then I might point at it and say 'this datum is probably not right, it isn't on my line'. Or I might say 'this data point is...' or 'this point...'. I would *never* use 'data' allone to signify a single datum.
Data has been reclasified as a mass noun, which is not quite the same as being singular allthough does mean that it acts as singular in many cases.
Thus data (like sugar) does not apply to the individial bits one at a time and you can use 'less' even though there are actually finitely many bits involved because you don't *count* data like that, usually because you have vast numbers.
For the same reasons I don't say 'I have fewer sugars' I don't say 'I have fewer data' it is 'less sugar' and 'less data'.
Data certainly isn't a singular word allthough since it is a mass noun I might think of 'a piece of data' rather than 'a datum' since the singular is not much in use in English. Most people never *use* the singular, most people never *have* the singular.
Additionally on a computer data is measured fairly continuously (yes, of course there is a 'unit of data' from a computer standpoint, just as there is a unit of sugar, but it is ludicrously small). Thus I would say "I have 2 gig of MP3s and you have only 1 so you have less data than me".
Depends on context. I'd instinctively treat "data" as a mass noun in a computer context, but as the plural of "datum" in a scientific context. I don't think I can usefully justify this view, but I think it's the way my language centres would jump if I weren't thinking hard about it.
In computing, "data" is almost always used as a mass noun, like "water" or "information". We say "how much data" (not "how many data"). If I wanted a construction with fewer, I would have to qualify it with a count noun, perhaps "fewer data points" or "fewer bytes of data".
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(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:39 pm (UTC)I voted 'less' on the grounds that I almost always mean that, but occasionally I am thinking in terms of datums, and might then use data as a plural.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:47 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:53 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 09:07 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 02:06 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-23 10:31 pm (UTC)That is, I did go and check on wikipedia when I read your first post, I'm sorry, I forgot to say so.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:41 pm (UTC)Of course personally I'm in favour of more data
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:42 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:45 pm (UTC)'Data' was borrowed into English as a loan-word from Latin. Originally it was probably understood that this was a plural form. However, over the course of a few generations it was reanalysed as a singular, because that made life simpler and we English don't generally form plurals with {-a}. Plus, we don't have the word 'datum' (correction: we do, but it's got a totally different meaning). Etymology ain't worth jack-shit to most people except linguistic pedants - the rest of us form our mental grammars by abductive logic, which is why languages change.
Egad, I'm opinionated today.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:47 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 08:23 pm (UTC)Data has been reclasified as a mass noun, which is not quite the same as being singular allthough does mean that it acts as singular in many cases.
Thus data (like sugar) does not apply to the individial bits one at a time and you can use 'less' even though there are actually finitely many bits involved because you don't *count* data like that, usually because you have vast numbers.
For the same reasons I don't say 'I have fewer sugars' I don't say 'I have fewer data' it is 'less sugar' and 'less data'.
Data certainly isn't a singular word allthough since it is a mass noun I might think of 'a piece of data' rather than 'a datum' since the singular is not much in use in English. Most people never *use* the singular, most people never *have* the singular.
Additionally on a computer data is measured fairly continuously (yes, of course there is a 'unit of data' from a computer standpoint, just as there is a unit of sugar, but it is ludicrously small). Thus I would say "I have 2 gig of MP3s and you have only 1 so you have less data than me".
I am unaware of any *other* meaning for datum.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 09:08 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 05:46 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 06:15 pm (UTC)(5 datums or less, anyone?)
Err, not that there's a prize.
Date: 2005-12-21 06:17 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 06:17 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 06:37 pm (UTC)YB: What dat?
Me: What is it, you know what it is.
YB: A winging!
Me: Yes, it's a penguin.
YB: Anna 'at!
I think he's got icon love.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 07:43 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 08:46 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 06:51 pm (UTC)Tomorrow I may feel differently.
(S)
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 07:33 pm (UTC)Is "try and [verb]" so commonly used instead of "try to [verb]" that it's a lost cause now?
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 08:26 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 08:53 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 09:32 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 01:01 pm (UTC)*cry*
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 07:29 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 08:25 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-21 08:51 pm (UTC)(I feel a bit like an AOL user for saying so but, well, you didn't provide a suitable poll option. :-p )
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 10:25 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 11:32 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-22 02:51 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-27 06:07 pm (UTC)